Talk:Quinquagesima

It is inaccurate to suggest that "the Anglican churches" dropped this terminology "six years later". Individual provinces within the Anglican Communion have revised their calendars on various timescales, but in any case The Book of Common Prayer of the Church of England has not had its calendar revised and the three Sundays before Lent retain their old names there. An alternative calendar is available and widely used in the Church of England, as part of Common Worship. This does drop the traditional names. But neither does it adopt the usage of numbering all of them as Nth after Epiphany. The CW calendar usage can be found at http://cofe.anglican.org/worship/liturgy/commonworship/texts/calendar/seasons.html.

Correction -Mar-2006

The text said that Quinq. was 50 days before Good Friday - this is just plain wrong there are 47. Saltmarsh 14:11, 4 March 2006 (UTC)

Last Epiphany

Isn't Quinquagesima always the same as Last Epiphany in the Anglican calculations? --Aquatiki (talk) 23:42, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

The title

Is there some compelling reason to have the title in Latin when the Catholic church has dropped the occasion and the RCL calls it "Transfiguration Sunday"? -- ke4roh (talk) 19:58, 15 February 2015 (UTC)

The "ordinary form" of the Roman rite doesn't use the title; the "extraordinary form" still does, and I've never heard any of the three Sundays before Lent called anything in English other than their Latin names. Every Latin/English missal I've seen refers to it as "Quinquagesima Sunday" - whereas the next Sunday isn't called Quadragesima Sunday, but the First Sunday of Lent. PaulGS (talk) 23:31, 17 February 2015 (UTC)

Not being a Roman Catholic, I can't vouch for what Roman Catholics tend to call the Sunday before Lent. Presumably those who like the extraordinary form call it 'Quinquagesima' and those who like the ordinary form call it the Sunday before Lent (since in that calendar it has no real name, in different years being the Fourth, Fifth, Sixth, etc. Sunday of Ordinary Time). In the Church of England, where I'm training to be a priest, most churches no longer use the Book of Common Prayer calendar, but those who do would, I expect, call it 'Quinquagesima'. Most of the church, which uses the Common Worship calendar, would call it either the official name, the 'Sunday next before Lent' (e.g. in service sheets and on music lists), or just the 'Sunday before Lent' (e.g. in speech). So, in my opinion, to call the page Quinquagesima is a bit antiquarian, which is why last year I moved the page to 'Sunday before Lent', which I thought was a sufficiently neutral name, having the advantage of including the Orthodox equivalent as well. Hey ho. DTOx (talk) 12:43, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

The names are not specifically Catholic, Lutheran has/had the same, and as long as we have Septuagesima, it's logical to have Quinquagesima. Many links go to this article, from that name, for example. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:07, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

You say if we have an article called 'Septuagesima', it's logical to have one called 'Quinquagesima'. That may be, but the Sunday before Lent has more of an existence in the new calendars than Septuagesima. As far as I'm aware Septuagesima has completely disappeared from most calendars: the RC ordinary form calendar has no specific readings or prayers for the third Sunday before Lent, and nor does the RCL. The modern CofE calendar has prayers (collect and post communion) for the Third Sunday before Lent, but the readings are those of whatever Sunday of Ordinary Time has been reached. Sexagesima again is completely absent from the modern RC calendar (no readings or prayers) and the RCL, but the modern CofE calendar has readings and prayers for the Second Sunday before Lent. Finally, the Sunday before Lent is absent from the modern RC calendar (no readings or prayers), present in the RCL ('Transfiguration Sunday'), and present in the modern CofE calendar ('the Sunday next before Lent'). So my point is that Septuagesima only really exists *as Septuagesima*, while Quinquagesima exists as several other things as well, and a more neutral name might be helpful.

Helpful for whom? You seem to speak for one denomination only, present day. There are others, and there's history. We still would need a redirect for the historic cases (had that for a while), and it can be the other way around just as well, that's what we have. "Sunday before Lent" is long and self-explanatory. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 18:07, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

Those in the ordinary form might call it the Sunday before Lent; more likely, they'd call it the Fifth (or Sixth, or Seventh, or Eighth, or Ninth) Sunday in Ordinary Time. Just because it's absent from the 1970 calendar doesn't mean it's any less notable, as the 45 years since that calendar were introduced are hardly anything compared to the centuries when it was - and the older calendar, while much less used now than it used to be, has never entirely gone away. Besides, Quinquagesima Sunday and the current Sunday in Ordinary Time aren't at all the same thing - Septuagesima and the two following Sundays weren't just renamed. I don't know what it's called in Protestant denominations, but in Catholic use, I've never heard of it being called "Sunday before Lent", unless as a kind of description rather than a name - "Quinquagesima is the Sunday before Lent", or that sort of thing. PaulGS (talk) 06:25, 21 February 2015 (UTC)

I think the article is mostly a help for those who want to know what Quinquagesima is, links will come from that term. It was of importance to Lutheran liturgy in Bach's time as the last Sunday before a quiet time, the last chance for music. They called it Estomihi, though ;) - We don't need an article for something merely descriptive such as "Sunday before Lent". --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:33, 21 February 2015 (UTC)